Shell Server Turn Down

Advanced feature discussion, beta programs and unsupported "Labs" features.
88 posts Page 6 of 9
by apl » Sun Jun 02, 2024 3:52 pm
Note that sftp.sonic.net (which supports the sftp protocol) is just an alias for shell.sonic.net, the machine that will be going away next month.
ftp.sonic.net (which, per Kelsey earlier in this thread, supports "ftp over explicit ssl") is a different machine and will still be supported

curlftpfs looks interesting, I may check that out as well.

Another thing I noticed when playing around with all this:
I've always gotten to my web space on the shell server via ~/public_html/ which was linked to /home/www_pages/<username>/
/home/www_pages/ is itself a link to /web/
On the ftp server the /home/www_pages/ link does not exist, but /home/WWW_pages/ does. (The shell server has both.)
So I changed the link from my home directory to use the version with capital letters, so it would work on both the shell server and the ftp server:
unlink public_html
ln -s /home/WWW_pages/<username>/ public_html
by nbs » Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:06 pm
nbs wrote: Sun Jun 02, 2024 1:42 pm I discovered `curlftpfs` today (h/t https://linuxconfig.org/mount-remote-ft ... filesystem) and am able to do this on my Linux laptop:

Code: Select all

mkdir sonic_ftp
curlftpfs nbs:PASSWORD@ftp.sonic.net sonic_ftp
My homedir on sonic has a symbolic link from `web` to `/home/WWW_pages/nbs/`, but the symlink doesn't work over FTP it seems. So I've created _another_ mount point on my local laptop, `sonic_ftp_www`, and mount that separately, as well.

Pro-tip, however (h/t https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... -curlftpfs) is that to mount a specific directory other than your home, you need two slashes at the beginning. So, e.g.:

Code: Select all

curlftpfs username@ftp.sonic.net://home/WWW_pages/username/ local_mount_point
by sjs » Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:31 pm
Dang. I asked exactly that question and no one responded. 💢 Great support there guys??
viewtopic.php?p=64398&hilit=sftp#p64398

Re: sftp as an alias: are you sure about that? When I run 'which sftp' it points at /usr/bin/sftp which from ls -l looks like a normal file. I realize ir is part of openssh but?? ftp is a really old & weak protol from what I've read.



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by ross707 » Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:39 am
Super bummed the shell server will be going away, also proud to be one of the die hard 100 with you all. I found it comforting to have a shell with my ISP, and truly feel this, and services like it set Sonic apart from their competitors.

I appreciate the information about panix.com, tildeverse and so on, also the run down on lftp and ftp over tls was helpful.

Like some of the others in this thread I too was wondering if we'll be losing web hosting for the username.members.sonic.net sites or our public ftp? It would appear the shell server and web server have different IP addresses so at this point I'm assuming we'll be all good and still able to access those files after the sshd turn down. Can anyone confirm this?
by tbessie » Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:01 pm
ross707 wrote: Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:39 amLike some of the others in this thread I too was wondering if we'll be loosing web hosting for the username.members.sonic.net sites or our public ftp? It would appear the shell server and web server have different IP addresses so at this point I'm assuming we'll be all good and still able to access those files after the sshd turn down. Can anyone confirm this?
Upon whom will we be loosing web hosting? Loose the dogs of war! ;-)
by lr » Thu Jun 06, 2024 9:19 am
Question: How about access to the web server logs? Today I can see them from the shell machine at /logs/by_user/<username>, but ftp doesn't seem to like that directory. On the shell machine, it seems to be an sshfs directory that is auto-mounted when I log in.

I think most of the rest of the files I've figured out how to read/write by ftp ... still checking ... I might have more questions if I find problems ...
Linda and Ralph and John
by lr » Thu Jun 06, 2024 9:26 am
And I'd like to make a slightly obnoxious comment: Having an rsync server (in addition to the ftp server) would be nice, as it is really more convenient. I'm not sure yet how to transmit only updated files with ftp when copying a whole directory tree, and whether ftp can even do that. Nor do I know how to automatically compare directory trees between the Sonic (web serving) copy and my original copy.

Yes, I understand running a whole shell server just for a few folks who happen to like rsync is insane. And I also understand that web serving is not where Sonic's future lies. Not just "understand", but respect.
Linda and Ralph and John
by ds_sonic_asif » Thu Jun 06, 2024 9:40 am
lr wrote: Thu Jun 06, 2024 9:26 am I'm not sure yet how to transmit only updated files with ftp when copying a whole directory tree, and whether ftp can even do that. Nor do I know how to automatically compare directory trees between the Sonic (web serving) copy and my original copy.
If you are running Linux, lftp has a mirror command that can be used for this.
by chongo » Fri Jun 14, 2024 2:04 pm
Dear Dane,

On your MOTD message

Regarding your Sonic.net MOTD: Shell Server Turn Down of 2024-05-01 16:11:
Dane Jasper here, to write a final message of the day (MOTD) to honor
the retirement of our shell server platform which will be turned off on
June 30th when it's (sic) operating system goes end of life.

Since starting Sonic in 1994, the use of Linux has been a key part of our
operation, and providing remote text-based shell access to a Linux host has
been included in our offerings.
You started off that MOTD so well. If you had finished that paragraph with
something along the lines of:
Unfortunately, many good things do come to
an end, and so with regret we must inform you that we have decided
that we will no longer provide shell access service as of the end of June.

Had you finished with something like that, I would have been little sad :( ,
but understanding. Instead, you wrote this:
Shell access was a very useful capability
in the early days of the internet, when home systems were connected at slow
speeds, while a centrally hosted shell server would have very high speed
access to the internet. And shell access provided a centralized gateway
to much of the early culture of the internet, via text-based access to the
Usenet discussion forums and internet relay chat (IRC) channels, email and
more. Today the internet has largely moved beyond these text-only
applications, and Sonic members have too. Today just one hundred die-hard
members continue to log in and access our shell service platform. As a
result of the evolution of the internet away from shell applications and
services, plus the workload involved in keeping a secure shell platform
online, we have made the decision to finally shut down our Linux shell
platform.
I take umbrage :x with your paragraph.

My reaction to your MOTD message

I am not going to argue the reasons why some text-only applications are
still widely used across the internet. I am not going to try and convince you
why someone with a number of servers at home might use shell access
to a server outside of their home. I am not going to try to get Sonic to reverse
their decision as it was Sonic's decision to make and I accept that.

I do, however want to impress on you just how insulting I found
your attempt to seemingly rationalize the decision by attempting to imply
the shell service users are somehow out of step with the Internet today.

Signing off

I plan to terminate my Sonic account, when I find the time to call in.
In the meantime, I don't care if you cancel my account or not.

Finally: instead of signing off your MOTD to the actual users of the shell server,
you chose instead to provide a salutation to the server itself!
To our Linux shell server platform: So long, and thanks for all the fish.
How fitting: give a salutation to the server and not the users. :-(

Dane: in the translated tongue of those who lived near the
three-mile-high collapsed letters above the Sirius Cybernetics Complaints Division:

Share and Enjoy

And to those people who used the shell server: I hope
you Don't panic but instead find a new service that meets your needs.
And last, I hope you will always know where your towel is. :-)

-- Landon Noll
by chongo » Mon Jun 17, 2024 3:37 pm
We have cancelled our Sonic service.
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