Conclusion of DSL intro pricing, your experience?

[avoong]

No, I can't get Fusion.

What are your experience after the DSL intro pricing has "expired"? Did you switch to another ISP? Stayed with Sonic?

Is it possible to negotiate the price?

[wa2ibm]

Introductory pricing is essentially a special contract period price. When that expires, you will transition to month-to-month pricing. At that point, you can call sales and ask for the current term contract price. They will gladly sign you up for a term contract (I think one year), which is less than the monthly rate. It's not as good a the introductory rate, but it's better than the month-to-month rate.

[virtualmike]

When I finished my first paid year with Sonic.net DSL (before Fusion), my monthly rate went up. I called the sales number, and the person with whom I spoke immediately offered to lower the price to to something within a few dollars of the initial rate. Of course, I accepted.

I don't recall that either price locked me into a commitment.

[dane]

We used to have low intro prices followed by high out of term rates, and then if it was feasible and we could re-commit the customer, we would be able to offer a lower rate somewhere in the middle. But, now we no longer have such high subsequent rates, so there is no room for movement.

The first year is sold at a loss, below our cost to AT&T for the DSL and ATM portions. It's an awful model, but we found it was the only way to win customers.

Thankfully, on Fusion we control the pricing and have fixed costs, so we can run the model differently: one fair and low price for the services delivered, all the time.

-Dane

[Jason]

The first year is sold at a loss, below our cost to AT&T for the DSL and ATM portions. It's an awful model, but we found it was the only way to win customers.

Wow, Sonic is subsidizing my Internet! Thanks, but it is unlikely I will stay beyond the intro period if Fusion doesn’t get deployed in my area (PLTNCA13) by then.

Fusion is unquestionably a great deal, but AT&T line-shared DSL, after the intro period, isn’t. After the intro period my DSL Elite (6M) will cost $60 including $20 for AT&T phone service which I rarely use but required to maintain to have Sonic DSL. For the same or slightly less price, I can have twice fast business class internet from AT&T or Comcast that doesn’t have data cap.

It appears Fusion is deployed in most part of the Bay Area by now. It is something unexpected to me that Tri-valley (Dublin, Pleasanton, Livermore, and maybe San Ramon) is ignored by Fusion this long.

Sonic may steer new customers to its way with subsidized DSL for the intro period. To truly *win* the customers, it will take Fusion.

[kenlui]

Fusion is unquestionably a great deal, but AT&T line-shared DSL, after the intro period, isn’t. After the intro period my DSL Elite (6M) will cost $60 including $20 for AT&T phone service which I rarely use but required to maintain to have Sonic DSL. For the same or slightly less price, I can have twice fast business class internet from AT&T or Comcast that doesn’t have data cap.

I disagree. Sonic DSL is a great deal because there are no caps and they have shown more than once that they fight for their users' rights. Sonic customer support are friendly and don't treat their callers like idiots.

I considered Comcast but you don't know what your local node's subscriber density is so your ultimate bandwidth is a crap shoot as there is no dedicated infrastructure for business customers. As far as I'm aware, you're forced to use Comcast's modem that has a monthly fee if you were to go with their business subscription.

There appears to be a $15 premium to AT&T U-verse business compared to normal U-verse. The only positive you have is if you could be served by a VRAD, you would be able to get more than 6 Mbps: [$55 for up to 6 Mbps;] $60 for up to 12 Mbps; $90 for up to 18 Mbps; $100 for up to 24 Mbps. Their terms also suggest that the modem is owned by AT&T and you need to pay a monthly fee. This was true of U-verse VDSL and not true for their U-verse HSI (IPDSLAM) infrastructure. But their IPDSLAM is only applicable if you're served by a CO, therefore if you can get U-verse IPDSLAM, you should be able to get Fusion.

[Jason]

I disagree. Sonic DSL is a great deal because there are no caps and they have shown more than once that they fight for their users' rights. Sonic customer support are friendly and don't treat their callers like idiots.

My earlier posting was in fact aimed at Dane to plead him for Fusion deployment in Pleasanton. Sonic DSL and others were used as comparison against Fusion.

Whether Sonic DSL is a great deal or not is situational and subjective. In my case, I have no good use of AT&T home phone. I just need a fast, reliable and stable Internet connection with no data cap at a low cost. I had SBC/AT&T DSL and AT&T/Comcast cable internet at my current place in the past, and they all served my needs well till they came up with the data cap. I got sick and tired of monitoring my usage (thanks to two teen agers at home), and switched to Sonic DSL.

Other than data cap, I had no complaint about AT&T DSL and Comcast cable. Both were very reliable and stable. I cannot rate their customer service against Sonic’s as I don’t have meaningful experiences with any of them in recent years. I didn’t need to call the customer service other than calls to cancel the services. Probably the best customer service is no (need for) customer service.

As for supporting a local company that “fights for user’s rights” I wouldn’t include it in “great deal” factors. I’d rather place it under the value system, and use it as a casting vote when everything else is comparable.

That said, based on my non-scientific subjective experience at my place, Sonic and other ISPs are comparable in the area of reliability, stability, and customer support (n.a. due to lack of meaningful experience). That narrows the factors to the speed and the cost. I compared post-promo Sonic DSL against the comparably priced business class Internet plans from AT&T and Comcast available at my place. Sonic DSL 6M for $60 is clearly not very competitive in my case.

Again, the comparison is situational. If one has a good use of AT&T phone, it is a different math.

I considered Comcast but you don't know what your local node's subscriber density is so your ultimate bandwidth is a crap shoot as there is no dedicated infrastructure for business customers. As far as I'm aware, you're forced to use Comcast's modem that has a monthly fee if you were to go with their business subscription.

There appears to be a $15 premium to AT&T U-verse business compared to normal U-verse. The only positive you have is if you could be served by a VRAD, you would be able to get more than 6 Mbps: [$55 for up to 6 Mbps;] $60 for up to 12 Mbps; $90 for up to 18 Mbps; $100 for up to 24 Mbps. Their terms also suggest that the modem is owned by AT&T and you need to pay a monthly fee. This was true of U-verse VDSL and not true for their U-verse HSI (IPDSLAM) infrastructure. But their IPDSLAM is only applicable if you're served by a CO, therefore if you can get U-verse IPDSLAM, you should be able to get Fusion.

Some of the plan details kenlui wrote are different from what I researched. Here are summary of the two plans available to my place at $50-$60 range for comparison purpose.

Comcast business Internet at 12M costs $60. Must be installed by a technician at one time cost of $200/$100/$50 depending on the contract term 1/2/3 years. Customers can use their own modem. (This is a recent change.) *Business class* no data cap.

AT&T U-verse plan information was confusing at best. So I followed AT&T U-verse order pages for small business half way through to see what is actually available. I can order 12M U-verse HSI business for $50. 1-2 year contract required. Free technician installation. Must buy an AT&T-provided modem for one time cost of $25 ($75 minus $50 rebate). It can be ordered without phone service. No data cap.

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I don’t mean to promote the plans from Sonic’s competitions. My goal is to draw Dane’s attention and plead him for Fusion deployment in my area, Pleasanton. Dane, you may edit or delete any or all part of my postings as appropriate.
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Jason

[dane]

My earlier posting was in fact aimed at Dane to plead him for Fusion deployment in Pleasanton. Sonic DSL and others were used as comparison against Fusion.

Might be best to engage in this dialog in a new thread with a more on-topic title.

-Dane

[avoong]

Thanks for the responses!!

My term ends in April, so still have some time to shop around, but not much options out there. Mainly looking at Comcast, but not sure how consistent the speed is in my neighborhood.

I agree that the $40 DSL price after the introductory isn't a deal, which totals over $50 with AT&T phoneline...for 6mbps. But I would gladly pay this price, than go back to AT&T with their 150GB cap they can't even measure accurately.

My DSL experience with Sonic has been extraordinary, with a stable and consistent connection, maxed out at 600+kbps, sometimes even more. And best of all...NO DATA CAPS!!! This might win me over at the end.

[dane]

You will also find that any price that beats ours is temporary. Do you want to be a nomad, changing providers every year for the loss leader? It's a nuisance.